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Initial Interview by NYPD Detective Mark Cohen 4/1/2003

Donna Langhorne (8:13 A.M.)

Q: Ms. Langhorne, this is an informal interview. However, you do have the right to an attorney of your choosing. If you cannot afford an attorney, the City will provide one for you. Moreover, any statements you make to me today could be used against you in a court of law. This interview is being taped. Do you understand and agree to these conditions?

A: Yes.

Q: Do you wish to be represented by an attorney?

A: Not at this time.

Q: If, at any time during this interview, you wish to be represented by an attorney, please make that known and the interview will cease until representation has been arranged. Is that understood?

A: Yes.

Q: I am now handing you a consent form in which you acknowledge that I have advised you of your right to be represented by any attorney and that you have elected to proceed without an attorney at this time. Are you comfortable signing this form?

A: Yes.

Q: The transcript of this interview will show that you reviewed the consent form, signed it and handed it to me. What is your full name?

A: Donna Reynolds Langhorne.

Q: Are you married?

A: Yes.

Q: Is Langhorne your married name?

A: Yes.

Q: What was your name before you were married?

A: Donna Maria Reynolds.

Q: What is your husband’s name?

A: Francis Langhorne.

Q: Have you ever used any other name?

A: Yes.

Q: What was that?

A: Maria Reynolds.

Q: Why and when did you use Maria Reynolds as your name?

A: From 1987 through 1990, I modeled for the Cleck Agency.

Q: What kind of modeling did you do?

A: Mainly swimsuits.

Q: Why did you stop modeling?

A: (laughs) Is that germane to your investigation, detective?

Q: Anything could be germane to the investigation. Should I repeat the question?

A: I quit modeling to go to business school.

Q: Have you ever used any other names?

A: No.

Q: Have you ever been married to anyone other than your current husband?

A: No.

Q: Do you and your husband presently reside together?

A: Do you really need all of this personal information? I have a lot of work to do to prepare for the public announcement of Larry’s death.

Q: Ms. Langhorne, these are routine questions we must ask each witness. I apologize if they are personal or tedious and I know your time is very valuable but there are rules I have to follow in every case of violent death. Do you and your husband presently reside together?

A: Yes ... yes, we do.

Q: What is your address?

A: 195 East 95th Street.

Q: Is there an apartment number?

A: No, it’s a brownstone.

Q: What is your husband’s occupation?

A: He is an attorney. 
 Look, detective, I appreciate that you’re following your rules. I have some rules I need to follow as well. As a public company we must make prompt disclosure of a material event — and Larry’s death is a material event. This is an SEC rule and my company is at risk if I don’t follow it.  Isn’t there some way you could ask me just the pertinent questions now and come back later and find out all about me?

Q: Ms. Langhorne, I will try to conclude this interview as expeditiously as possible. Where and when were you born?

A: I was born on April 15th, 1966 in Princeton, New Jersey.

Q: What is your educational background?

A: I have a Masters Degree from Harvard Business School.

Q: And before that?

A: Do you want every school I ever attended?

Q: If you recall them, yes.

A: I went to PDS — Princeton Day School — from kindergarten through high school. I then attended Princeton University and graduated in 1985. As I said, I have a Masters Degree from Harvard Business School. I am also a CPA.

Q: How long have you worked at ... uh... hackoff.com?

A: The name embarrasses quite a few people, detective. You get used to it. I’ve been with hackoff since 1997.

Q: In what capacity did you join the company?

A: I joined hackoff as CFO — Chief Financial Officer — and have held that position ever since.

Q: What was your prior employment?

A: I worked at Ernst & Young.

Q: What kind of company is that?

A: It is one of the major worldwide accounting firms.

Q: How long were you at Ernst & Wong?

A: It’s Ernst & Young, detective. I was there from 1991 after I received my MBA until I joined hackoff in 1997.

Q: Where were you employed by Ernst?

A: At various locations in New York and New Jersey. I’m afraid I don’t have the addresses memorized.

Q: I can get those later. How long have you known the deceased?

A: We were classmates at Harvard. We kept in touch after that. When he founded hackoff, he offered me the job as CFO.

Q: So you first met in 1990?

A: Actually, 1989. Larry went to Harvard for his undergraduate degree; I went to Princeton. We met at Harvard B-School in 1989.

Q: Harvard B-School?

A: Harvard Business School. It’s a graduate school.

Q: What was your relationship with the deceased while at Harvard?

A: We were friends.

Q: Friends. Could you be more specific?

A: What do you mean — “more specific”? We were friends.

Q: What sort of friends?

A: Do you mean were we fucking?

Q: I mean ... uh ... what was the extent of your relationship with the deceased when you were in school together? That does include any sexual ... any intimate relationship you might have had.

A: Are these answers private?

Q: This is not generally public information and is not released as part of FOI (excuse me, Freedom of Information Act) requests. However, as I explained at the beginning of our interview, anything you tell me may be used in a court of law and this interview is being taped. Would you like me to repeat the question?

A: No. But please understand that I’m sensitive about this because my husband doesn’t know about my relationship with Larry at Harvard. Anyway, yes — Larry and I did have an ... “intimate” relationship. Meaning, we had sex. No big thing; we both saw other people. It lasted for a while, then it ended.

Q: When did your relationship with the deceased end?

A: When he died. Oh, you mean the ... the “intimate” part? The sex? That ended before we got our MBAs. But we stayed friends.

Q: Ms. Langhorne, don’t take this the wrong way, but was your ... intimate relationship with the deceased the reason that you have your current position at, uh ... hackoff?

A: Why shouldn’t I take it the wrong way? (laughs) The fact that I know Larry and we kept track of each other has a lot to do with him offering me this job and me taking it. The fact that we were once “intimate” has nothing to do with my having this job. I’m the best CFO hackoff could have had and Larry damn well knew it. I didn’t exactly jump at the job, though. I had other offers; a lot of startups needed CFOs then.

Q: Why wouldn’t you “jump at the job”?

A: Isn’t it obvious? Larry’s a bright guy, but his record is somewhat ... irregular. He’s been to jail, for one thing.  I wasn’t all that sure I wanted to be CFO of a company headed by an ex-con, even if he was an old friend. You do know about his jail time, I assume?

Q: What convinced you to take the job given the deceased’s “irregular” record?

A: We’re in the business of stopping hackers from doing what Larry showed could be done to the banks. Larry had the perfect background for this business. It really does take one to catch one, detective. Not only is this the truth, it’s also a great story. I did due diligence before taking the job and I knew VCs loved the story.

Q: What are VCs?

A: Venture capitalists or “vulture” capitalists as some people call them. They supply money to a company before it goes public, then they take lots and lots of money out.

Q: So what did the VCs “love” about hackoff.com?

A: I told you: They loved the STORY. They talked to bankers and bankers loved the story; thought it would make for a great IPO. There were too many stories that all sounded the same in 1997. Too many “Two Geeks and a Website” stories. An experienced hacker solving one of the toughest problems in e-commerce was new and different. It was a clutter cutter.

Q: Was that why you took the job? Because the company was a something “cutter”?

A: Clutter cutter, Detective Cohen, clutter cutter. (laughs) I took the job because the company had a great fucking story; we would be able to raise a lot of money; we would have a great IPO and we would all get rich. And it all happened exactly that way — though not without a lot of hard work and not without my doing a great job as CFO. Hackoff sounded like a winner and it was a winner.

Q: Let’s get to this morning...

A: Well, finally! I’ve got to get to my Board meeting and I’ve got an announcement to write ... on a deadline.

Q: You discovered the body of the deceased — correct?

A: Yes.

Q: At approximately what time?

A: Approximately 7:00 AM. That’s when I usually come to work.

Q: Did the deceased usually come to work at the same time?

A: Are you kidding? We were lucky if he breezed in around ten or eleven.

Q: Where did you discover the body of the deceased?

A: In his office.

Q: Did you usually go into the deceased’s office when you came to work? You did say he was rarely there at that time.

A: You have a suspicious mind, Detective Cohen. I guess that’s what makes you a good cop. No, I don’t ... didn’t usually go into Larry’s office in the morning. But on my way into my office I could see that his door was ajar. That’s very unusual; he’s careful to lock it. So I went to close it.  And when I went to close it I looked inside and there was Larry lying on the floor.

Q: Go on.

A: That’s it. That’s how I discovered Larry’s body in his office.

Q: So what did you do next?

A: I went into the office to see why Larry was lying on the floor.

Q: What did you think?

A: I thought maybe he had a heart attack or maybe he’d OD-ed on something.

Q: Did the deceased take drugs?

A: Do you mean illegal drugs?

Q: Yes.

A: Not that I know of.

Q: Did he take drugs when you were in school together?

A: Yeah. We did some drugs. We even inhaled. You’re not going to arrest me for that NOW, are you?

Q: Do you know if the deceased was recently a user of illegal substances?

A: No. I don’t. I said that, didn’t I?

Q: But your first thought was that he OD-ed...

A: That was my second thought. My first thought was that he’d had a heart attack. He didn’t exactly have a stress-free job. I don’t know why I thought he might have OD-ed. It was just strange for him to be lying there.

Q: What did you do when you went into the room where the deceased was lying?

A: I checked the scene.

Q: You what?

A: I checked the scene. First Aid 101: When you see a victim—

Q: At this point you thought the deceased was a victim of something?

A: We all took CPR, detective. In CPR, any person you come across lying on the floor is “the victim”. Doesn’t matter how they got there. And when you come across a victim, you check the scene. Make sure there are no other victims; no live wires; no poison gasses. And you have to make sure the scene is safe for you to give first aid. So I checked the scene.

Q: What did you see when you “checked the scene”?

A: I saw a gun lying on the floor next to Larry. That seemed a pretty obvious cause of death. I didn’t see anything else unusual.

Q: So then what did you do?

A: I got down on the floor next to Larry so I could see whether he had a pulse.

Q: And did he have a pulse?

A: When I got down next to him I could see the big hole in his head. I could see INTO his head. I knew he couldn’t be alive. There was no first aid I could give. There was nothing I could do for him. He was dead — awfully dead.

Q: Then what did you do?

A: I called 911.

Q: Did you pick up the gun?

A: No. I’ve seen enough cop shows to know not to do anything like that, not to tamper with evidence.

Q: So your fingerprints shouldn’t be on the gun.

A: Actually, they probably are.

Q: Why? If you didn’t touch the gun, why should your finger prints be on it?

A: Because the gun was always on the conference table in Larry’s office. We picked it up and played with it sometimes during meetings. It was a joke.

Q: Are you sure this is the same gun that was on Larry’s conference table?

A: I don’t know much about guns, but it looked the same. And I don’t remember another gun on the conference table when I found his body, but I’m not sure I really looked. I wasn’t too rational once I saw the hole in his head.

Q: What kind of joke was the gun?

A: Just a joke. When things went badly, we talked about shooting ourselves but we really didn’t MEAN it. Sometimes we’d point the gun at each other jokingly during disagreements. Sometimes we’d pretend we were playing Russian Roulette when we had a tough decision to make.

Q: Pointing a gun isn’t very smart. Weren’t you afraid it might be loaded?

A: No. We never thought about it as an actual gun. It was just a toy as far as we were concerned.

Q: Are you saying you thought it was a toy gun?

A: No. We knew it was a real gun because it had some sort of story behind it. Some guy Larry’d been in jail with gave it to him; told him, “This is the way you rob banks — not with computers.” That’s all I remember of the story. I meant it was LIKE a toy. We played with it. I never thought of it having real bullets. I certainly never thought that anyone would shoot themselves with it.

Q: You think Larry shot himself?

A: Yes. Don’t you? We’re in the process of writing a press release which says exactly that. One of your cops told me Larry has powder burns on his right hand.

Q: Which cop?

A: I don’t know; one of them. Like I said: a cop. He was wearing blue.

Q: We have no official opinion of the cause of death at this time. Ascertaining the cause of death is the purpose of this investigation. No policeman is authorized to speculate as to the cause or discuss evidence with witnesses.

A: I see. Do you have an “unofficial opinion” of the cause of death?

Q: We have no opinions at this time. This interview will go more quickly if I ask the questions.

A: Please — go ahead. I really do need to get to my Board meeting.

Q: At any time after discovering the body did you touch the deceased, his clothes, or the weapon?

A: I didn’t touch the gun — I said that. I did touch Larry’s neck to take his pulse. He was very cold.

Q: You said you could see that he was dead of a bullet wound. Why would you take his pulse?

A: I don’t know. I think I touched his neck anyway; maybe just because meant to take his pulse. He was very, very cold.

(interview continued in next episode)

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Interview of Donna Langhorne by Detective Cohen (continued)

Q:   When was the last time you saw the deceased alive?

A:   When I left the office last night. His office door was closed but I could hear him talking on the phone.

Q:   When was that?

A:   About six.

Q:   Were there other people in the office besides you and the deceased when you left?

A:   There must have been about fifty people. This is a startup, not a nine-to-five company. The receptionist was gone, but most of the technical staff were here. Most programmers come in late and work late. Other people stay late.

Q:   Can you name some of the people who were here when you left?

A:   I’m sure I can.

Q:   May I please have some names?

A:   Uh ... Dom Montain, he’s our CTO.

Q:   What’s a CTO?

A:   Chief Technical Officer.

Q:   He was here when you left last night?

A:   I’m sure he was.  He always works late.

Q:   Did you actually see him when you were leaving?

A:   I’m not sure. Maybe. I think so. I think I said good night to him.

Q:   Who else?

A:   Irma Sukander. She was in the lady’s room when I went in just before leaving.

Q:   What is her job?

A:   Programmer.

Q:   Anyone else?

A:   There were lots of other people, but I don’t remember specifically who.

Q:   Did anyone see you leave?

A:   Irma saw me prepare to leave.

Q:   Did anyone see you actually leave?

A:   Any number of people MIGHT have seen me leave. I... wait! Kevin Wong walked down the steps with me.

Q:   What’s his job?

A:   He’s another programmer.

Q:   I thought you said programmers work late. Why was he leaving at six?

A:   I think he was making a pizza run. Programmers live on pizza and caffeinated soft-drinks. There were a lot of pizza boxes stacked in the trash this morning.

Q:   Where did you go after you left the office?

A:   Home.

Q:   How did you get there?

A:   Subway.

Q:   Do you always take the subway?

A:   Usually, why?

Q:   Isn’t that unusual? I think of executives using a car service, not the subway.

A:   Not if they want to get anywhere in a hurry — not in New York.

Q:   When did you get home?

A:   Sometime before seven. I saw the beginning of the national news.

Q:   Was your husband home?

A:   No.

Q:   Did he come home later?

A:   No.

Q:   Is he on a business trip?

A:   He’s away from home.

Q:   Is he often away from home?

A:   Does it matter? Does it matter to this investigation? Can we get this done?

Q:   I can never tell what matters until I ask the question; I’m sorry but that’s the way it is. Was anyone else with you at any time last night?

A:   No.

Q:   Did anyone see you come home or leave in the morning? A doorman?

A:   I told you, we live in a brownstone; we don’t have a doorman. As far as I know, no one saw me come or go.

Q:   Did anyone call you at home last night?

A:   Yes. Thanks for helping me with my alibi; I can tell you’ve done this before. I did get several calls from friends and business contacts. Some were on my cell phone so I guess that doesn’t count but some were on my landline as well. And I made some calls and did some e-mail.

Q:   I’ll want a list of the names and the times of calls as best you can remember them. Can you think of any reason why the deceased would have taken his own life?

A:   No. He was depressed about the low stock price and worried about more hostiles but he was a tough—

Q:   Hostiles? Hostile what?

A:   Hostile takeover attempts. About a year ago a major competitor — antihack — made an attempt to take over hackoff. That sometimes happens when your stock price is low. Larry was worried that there’d be more attempts since the stock price still sucks.

Q:   I assume guns aren’t used in hostile takeover attempts. Can you think of any reason why anyone would want to kill the deceased?

A:   There are lots of people who don’t like Larry; he’s not always ... he wasn’t always very nice. He put people down when he thought they were stupid or were wasting his time.  He played rough.

Q:   Played rough? Could you elaborate?

A:   He got a lot tougher when he was in jail. He liked to face people down; he liked to see them back down.

Q:   Who did he “face down”?

A:   The CEO of antihack, for one. They met at a benefit dinner while the hostile — the hostile takeover attempt — was going on. Wrobly put his arm around Larry like they were old friends. Larry told him, “Get that off me or I’ll  break it off at your shoulder, you fucking piece of shit.”

Q:   You witnessed this encounter?

A:   Yes. So did everyone at our table at the dinner.

Q:   Your table...

A:   Larry bought a table and filled it with whoever he pleased. That’s the way these charity things are done.

Q:   Who else did Larry “face down?”

A:   A lot of people, including Dom Montain whenever he had a chance. But this is a waste of time. Larry killed himself.  Maybe there are people who would’ve wanted to kill him and maybe there aren’t; but he killed himself.

Q:   How do you know that?

A:   One, because your cop told me about the powder burns. Two, it just makes sense. I mean, no one was in Larry’s office when I found him. No one had been in Larry’s office since 5:30 the night before.

Q:   How do you know that?

A:   I checked the security logs. See these cards we wear? these are RFIDs.

Q:   What’s an RFID?

A:   Radio Frequency Identifier Device. Everyone on staff wears them. Every time we enter or leave a room, a receiver gets the tag ID and knows who went in or who went out. It’s all logged.

Q:   What if someone comes in who isn’t wearing a tag?

A:   Then a big, loud alarm goes off and that incident is logged. That didn’t happen last night but it sometimes does.

Q:   So you checked these logs yourself?

A:   Of course.

Q:   Why didn’t you tell me about this earlier?

A:   You didn’t ask. Look, detective, I can’t seriously believe that you think Larry’s death was murder. I know you have to ask questions and establish alibis, but I’ve got to do my Board meeting and get my press release out or the SEC will really fry my ass.

Q:   Why do you have such an elaborate security system? Do you keep money or drugs here?

A:   (laughs) Detective, we keep something much more valuable than money or drugs here: the source code — the computer instructions — that are hackoff’s crown jewels. Our stuff is patented but it can still be stolen. More importantly, half the hackers in the world spend all their time and the rest spend half their time trying to hack into our customers’ websites. If they knew how hackoff’s software worked, they might be able to defeat it. Our intellectual property is priceless, and we guard it that way.

Q:   Who knows the most about this security system?

A:   Our security officer, Marlene Chou.

Q:   Is she here?

A:   Yes.

Q:   If you would be so kind as to send her in, I think I can let you go for now. I’ll need a list of people you talked to on the phone last night. Sometime today, please. If you think of anything else relevant to the investigation — even POTENTIALLY relevant to the investigation — please call me.  Thank you for your cooperation, Ms. Langhorne.

A:   You’re entirely welcome.

###

A telephonic meeting of the Board of Directors of hackoff.com Inc. (the “Corporation”) was held on April 1 at 9:00 AM Eastern time. 

Present were members Joseph Windaw, Joanne Ankers, Franklin Adams, and Donna Langhorne.  In addition, Aaron Smyth, Executive Vice President, General Counsel and Secretary of the Board, was present and kept minutes.

Mr. Windaw chaired the meeting in the absence of the Chairman, Larry Lazard.  All participants in the call could hear, and could be heard by, all other participants.

The following matters were covered:

1. Ms. Langhorne informed the Board of the death of Chairman and CEO, Larry Lazard. Ms. Langhorne related that she, herself, found the body at 7:00 AM this morning. A police investigation is underway. Although there has been no official determination of cause of death, indications point to suicide.  In addition to the New York City Police Department, NASDAQ and the SEC have also been informed, and NASDAQ has advised that trading in the company’s stock will be temporarily suspended pending dissemination of an announcement.
2. The Board decided that the positions of Chairman and CEO should be split in the future as is allowed by the Company’s bylaws.
3. The Board elected Joseph Windaw as non-executive Chairman. The vote was unanimous with the exception of Mr. Windaw, who abstained.
4. After a discussion from which Ms. Langhorne recused herself, the Board elected Ms. Langhorne as CEO.
5. The Board authorized Ms. Langhorne to engage an executive search firm to find a candidate to fill the Board position left vacant by Mr. Lazard’s death.
6. Ms. Langhorne recommended to the Board that it appoint Lew Marigold as acting CFO.  Ms. Langhorne advised the Board that she would like to take some time to determine if he is the right candidate to fill the position permanently.  The Board unanimously approved these recommendations.

There being no further business, the meeting was thereupon adjourned.

                                                                                                            Respectfully submitted,

                                                                                                            Aaron Smyth, Esq.

                                                                                                            Secretary

###

E-mail, April 1, 2003

From:     Joseph Windaw [mailto:jwindaw@windawwallar.com]

Sent:     Tuesday, April 1, 2003  9:45 AM

To:       Joanne Ankers

Subject:  Board Meeting

Do you think she really would’ve quit if we’d made her acting CEO?

From:     Joanne Ankers [mailto:joanne.ankers@bigrouter.com]

Sent:     Tuesday, April 1, 2003  9:55 AM

To:       Joseph Windaw

Subject:  RE: Board Meeting

We’ll never know. She plays her cards close to her very big chest:-}

From:     Donna Langhorne

Sent:     Tuesday, April 1, 2003  10:57 AM

To:       Ahmed Qali

Subject:  Contract Work

I want to assure you that there is no change in the status of your group as critical vendors to hackoff.com. Ongoing projects should be continued and outstanding invoices will be paid on a timely basis.

I want to thank you in advance for your cooperation in these difficult times.

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